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December 25, 2012
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Perhaps we're blaming the wrong thing.

:iconkillianseraphim:
KillianSeraphim Featured By Owner Dec 25, 2012  Student General Artist
I don't normally post on the Politics forum, I would prefer to stay out of this, but this has been on my mind due to this video [link]

While I am a gamer, and I think the accusations that video games incur violence is silly, I don't wish to make that statement here, I think the video states it well enough. People blame guns, another idea I find a bit flawed, but not one I wish to talk about here.

Question: Is our news media, inadvertently, responsible for these murders? Is our attention on these events, the special news reports, the investigation of the killer, the publicity, really what is to blame for them? I know "freedom of the press" and "freedom of speech" is going to be mentioned, but I'm just curious about how you would handle the situation.
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:iconmci021:
mci021 Featured By Owner Dec 31, 2012  Hobbyist Artisan Crafter
I think looking for any one answer is at best lazy thinking. It's not the media attention that drives people to do things like walk into a kindergarten and start shooting. It's not violent video games or movies and television, either. I think the real responsibility here lies with us. Far too often we simply don't see the people around us. We don't notice when people are struggling and we seem to be entirely unwilling to do what's necessary to help people who are struggling with mental illness. And then we're completely shocked when bad things happen while we were all asleep at the switch. If we want to stop these things, we need to build supportive communities who care for each other and look out for each other. Otherwise we're just going to keep on seeing history repeat itself.
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:iconspudfuzz:
Spudfuzz Featured By Owner Dec 30, 2012  Hobbyist Digital Artist
I put a heavy burden of blame on the media not just for sensationalizing shit that shouldn't then shifting blame for it - but for all kinds of general fuckupedness in society. Controlling people's perception of reality is kind of a huge deal and there needs to be some damn consequences for abusing that power.
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:iconaviscelox:
AvisCelox Featured By Owner Dec 29, 2012  Hobbyist General Artist
I think that even if playing violent video games makes children suggestible to violence (I don't think it does), it's the parents' fault for letting their kids play M rated games.

I agree that most of these people do this stuff for attention, attention they know they will get. They figure that if they're gonna go they should go in a way that makes people renember them. My friend put it this way: you die twice; once in body and again when your name is forgotten. I say we don't even need to know the shooter's name or at least face, just the names of the victims. It's the same mentality that people like the Westboro Baptist Church have: as long as people see them/their message no matter what light, they've accomplished their task.
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:iconjeysie:
Jeysie Featured By Owner Dec 30, 2012  Hobbyist Writer
The funny thing is, parents really have to go out of their way to let their kids play M-rated games.

I used to work at Toys R Us and covered lot of shifts in the game area (being pretty much the only general cashier that knew games well), and we had a policy that nobody could buy M-rated games without either ID or looking old enough, and I got a lot of parents griping at me about how I didn't let Little Johnny buy Grand Theft Auto 2 & 3. And not all of them relented after I explained why ("Do you really want Johnny playing a game where you steal things, shoot at cops, and have sex with hookers in cars?".)

So it's annoying to hear about cries for more regulation, because the regulation (or rather, the private sector equivalent thereof) is already freakin' there, and they just don't use it. They just apparently think no adult games should be made at all so they don't have to actually think about what they're buying.
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:iconjeysie:
Jeysie Featured By Owner Dec 28, 2012  Hobbyist Writer
Video games are a red herring for a lot of reasons.

But the one reason that really gets me is that it's really fucking irritating that people act like all video games are Halo or Call of Duty when those are, seriously, about 10% of the gaming industry, tops.

I'm an adventure gamer, a turn-based strategy gamer, a puzzle gamer, and a turn-based RPG gamer. Oftentimes I haven't even heard of the games the media says are supposedly typical of the "violent hobby", or I have only a vague idea of what they might be about. Hell, the only reason I know Halo even exists is because I like Red vs. Blue. =P

I mean, nobody can tell me with a straight face that Monkey Island or Grim Fandango are "murder simulators", and while games like Planescape and Fallout could be called violent, they're not the type of violence that convince you it's OK to go shoot up the local school.
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:iconcarusmm:
carusmm Featured By Owner Dec 27, 2012  Hobbyist Writer
Personally, I blame chewing gum.
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:iconscottahemi:
ScottaHemi Featured By Owner Dec 27, 2012  Hobbyist Digital Artist
makes sense, people like these kind of things. it's like watching a car crash... and the media loves it because they get huge ratings off these things.

I believe I even heard on the TV last week state something about the shooter at that school may have been inspired by that red headed psycho at the Batman shooting.

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:iconvisionoftheworld:
VISIONOFTHEWORLD Featured By Owner Dec 30, 2012
Was the red headed psycho a psycho BEFORE he committed the massacre at Batman, or just after? Was Adam Lanza a psycho before he shot 20 children or only after?
I just wanna figure out what you guys think a psycho is and how we're supposed to spot one ahead of time. Since giving everyone guns has already made sure any psychos out there already have enough fire power to take on a small army, and there isn't much we can do about their firepower. **Hint- instead of saying "do nothing" how about making it sound complex enough so I can't tell you're telling me we should do nothing?
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:iconmomoe:
momoe Featured By Owner Dec 27, 2012
Actually, CNN once interviewed an FBI forensic psychologist after another school shooting some time ago. He went right out and said that mainstream media needs to stop covering these shootings in the kind of fetishistic detail as they currently are or there will be many more school shootings. "Keep it boring and keep it local, as much as possible" he said. It made sense.

I'll try to find the vid and post it.

My opinion: Copy cat killers, who pattern themselves after famous serial killers presicely because of the fame the source of their inspiration attained is not a new thing. In fact this practice became fairly common back when serial killers only just began to spread in the media's lexicon and people were treating these losers as some kind of mythical bogeyman. It's not too hard to imagine current school shooting psychos are merely an extension of the same thing: Sad losers suddenly presented with an opportunity to become relevant to every man, woman and child in America.
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:iconbonnieknox:
BonnieKnox Featured By Owner Dec 27, 2012  Hobbyist General Artist
The video games again...

I played a lot of Doom back then

I played also that game, Carmaggedon, in which you used your own car to smash the opponents or ran over people and animals, I know, sick as fuck...

I watched a lot of Tarantino movies, gore movies and have a vast collection of true crime cases...

And...I know better than going around shooting people. Nobody is to blame for my shit, if I have any to complain about


People has been killing each other since the beginning of the times, US citizens have had guns since the building of this country, yet all those spree shooting are really recent (the first school shooter who set that "trend" was a 16 year old girl, Brenda Spencer, who in 1979 gunned down two adults and injured eight students). The fact that those acts gives notoriety to the perpetrators makes a lot of unhappy teens and young adults "to go down with fame shooting it out at the world". The media has to inform, but does not help with this, those criminals have copycats later.

Something fails in the society, and is not the games, gun ownership or movies. I was talking about this before with a friend and we agreed in one thing: In this society in which you are forced to hide your anger and being extremely polite in order to survive or stay out of trouble (lawsuits...), some individuals seem to "explode" when they can not take their frustrations anymore, also, the people does not seem to look for help until is too late. As a result you have all that silent building up anger. Some individuals explode, most do not, but the ones that explode, do it badly.
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:iconnovuso:
Novuso Featured By Owner Dec 28, 2012
I grew up playing Doom myself in the early 90s but that was fantasy violence though. Doom was never even close to being realistic. In doom you were shooting zombies and space monsters with cartoon guns. DOOM literally took place on the moon of Mars Phobes. It was easy to separate that type of game from real life. Modern FPS games are much more realistic where you are shooting humans in realistic settings such as schools, airports, and malls. Is it art imitating life or the other way around? I have always been against blaming video games as a scape goat but as I have grown older I must acknowledge that these types of games are not good for our culture.


You do have a point about people holding in anger and then exploding. With that being said people explode all the time though it rarely involves gun violence. People are a collection of their past experiences. If they have have seen a lot of violence in their lives then they are likely to react violently. The extreme violence in video games would certainly factor into those past experiences leading to increased violent outcomes.
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:iconfirstxaidxkit:
FIRSTxAIDxKIT Featured By Owner Dec 25, 2012  Professional Interface Designer
I think it's a case of the media/parents/corporations etc. to blame something instead of trying to believe that human beings are actually capable of committing such an atrocity due to mental illness or psychopathic tendencies. It's funny how those who are so adamant about protecting our second amendment rights couldn't care less about first amendment rights in regards to censoring violent video games. Do I think violent video games are going to be censored any more than they are? Of course not, because gaming is a business and they know that mature gamers that grew up with blood and body parts are going to not buy their games when they turn all blood off and give you slingshots instead of assault rifles.

It's actually kind of funny (and incredibly sad at the same time), because a day or two after the Sandy Hook shooting, one of the 12 year old students attempted to create this "campaign" where all these kids throw away their violent video games. The article mentioned that the child was an avid CoD player and even stated that the parents were okay with it. Well there's the fucking problem! We're blaming video games, yet we're disregarding the CLEAR ratings and the reasons for the "M" rating. Maybe if people paid more fucking attention to their children instead of conceding when they holler for trip to Gamestop, we can stop ignoring bad parenting problems and stop blaming medias that shouldn't have gotten into the kids' hands in the first place, regardless of any psychological effects they supposedly have.
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:iconquatre4:
Quatre4 Featured By Owner Dec 25, 2012  Student General Artist
Well the big reason not too many point out about these types of things in which people blame whatever it is that murder and steal. Like guns, and video games. The big reason people do this or the person who committed the crime used one of these scapegoats is because they don't want jail time. They would rather say they are crazy because of video games or something and go to a Looney bin and get meds for his so called illness then go to jail. It's just the way things are in our Judicial system. But yes the real problem is people, not guns, videogames, movies or whatever the media puts forward.
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:iconscnal:
Scnal Featured By Owner Dec 25, 2012  Hobbyist Digital Artist
They do it for power, always in some form or another. So, the media is somewhat to blame, since they're giving them power by reporting on them, but it's mainly the general norm in America to crave power so much while being concentrated in so few that's to blame (guns don't help, they seem like a cheap easy way to gain power and make it even worse, and while limiting them probably does help somewhat, the main issue requires fixing the whole country).
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:iconvisionoftheworld:
VISIONOFTHEWORLD Featured By Owner Dec 25, 2012
Well, as a gamer you should (or probably already do) understand that the extremely powerful gun lobby, all of its shills and all of its braindead zombie followers here and all over the web and corporate media need to find AS MANY THINGS AS POSSBILE to throw blame at for an increasingly out-of-control gun violence problem- rather than access to guns. The trick is- get people talking about random statistics (let's see- like 'more people die from falling off donkeys than by getting shot at") extracted from the NRA's vast archives of blame-stats to STEER PEOPLE AWAY from talking about making laws to control access to guns.
Every single response that I get right here will do precisely that- with a little "you're an insane/illogical/psychopath/lunatic for daring to suggest making laws in society is a solution to anything!" thrown in to make some sort of dumbass "point", but that's pretty much all I ever see. I haven't read one single reasonable argument about guns from the gun lobby{+its shills/zombies] yet. Because the only reasonable thing they could say is this: "We admit things are getting out of hand, we support reasonable laws surrounding access to fully-automatic or semi-automatic assault weapons and as a lobby will make our case that such laws don't infringe on the general right of those law abiding citizens who possess firearms."

If I'm insane for suggesting this in the eyes of some zombie fucktard conservative, then so be it. I'm glad I have morals and am on the good side, unlike them. It's a good place to be.
If anything I'd say video games are probably preferable to actual guns because they provide an instant release of tension in a totally controlled environment which is much safer than discharging a firearm.
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:icontheredsnifit:
TheRedSnifit Featured By Owner Dec 25, 2012
The media likely is at least partially responsible for them; it wouldn't surprise me if a lot of these people did it for instant celebrity status.
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:iconjuliabohemian:
Juliabohemian Featured By Owner Dec 25, 2012
We had violence and murder before videogames. It’s possible they have contributed in some small, indirect way, to some acts of violence, somewhere. But to label them as the cause is rather far fetched.
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:iconabstract-mindser:
Abstract-Mindser Featured By Owner Dec 25, 2012
Another thing to mention is that many schools where shootings happened already had armed guards. Columbine, Virginia Tech, and more. What did it prevent? JACK SQUAT.

More guns aren't going to help anything; this is something that the NRA will never willingly understand.
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:iconsaidryian:
Saidryian Featured By Owner Dec 25, 2012
I think America has a big problem with glorifying violence, and enjoying it to a very unhealthy degree. At the same time both it and its people does much to twist everyone up as much as seemingly possible, causing an endless amount of dysfunction, personal issues and mental problems left and right. I mean geez, sex seems like more of a crime than murder going by American TV and cinema. Endless slaughter, torture porn, gore flicks, countless gunfights, movies where thousands die? Totally fine! Bare breasts, sex scenes on the other hand? NEVER!

Then there's terror tactics, and company after company, advertisement after advertisement telling people that they can't be happy on their own. No, people need drugs, LOTS of drugs, just to function! If you're a girl you also have to dress up like a slut and be incredibly attractive to men, but noooooo, sex is BAD! And to men, you're supposed to be incredibly attracted to girls dressing that way, but don't go touching them you hear? Just because she dresses like she wants attention, doesn't mean you should be paying attention.

Look at American romance or drama shows, where no one is EVER happy for an extended period. In just about every TV series where a couple orbit each other for five+ seasons.... they FINALLY get together, only to break up five episodes later, drama drama drama! Other shows talk about how it's impossible to not cheat, or that there's nothing wrong with it.

Here, there, everywhere, people are told that they can't be happy, and that things can't be simple. People are messed UP because of it, and it's no wonder that without help, many go crazy or become highly unstable.

So... yeah... I have to agree that video games aren't to blame. They MIGHT indirectly help the already mentally disturbed, but media and society are far more to blame with getting people mentally unstable in the first place.

Now I'm not saying other countries don't suffer from the same things. At least, I don't think so. I know sex and breasts are far more openly accepted in other countries though, and people here in Australia seem to enjoy it quite a bit. Many tend to shun violence too, and most people I know can't stand torture porn like the SAW movies, or understand why it's even allowed to exist. I have a very biased view perhaps, but that's my input anyway.
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:iconcharityk:
CharityK Featured By Owner Dec 25, 2012  Hobbyist Photographer
Even though I think we could do more towards gun control in this country through different outlets I personally don't think media or even guns can be blamed for certain acts of violence. For the most part its the ignorance and lack of care or prevention towards those with mental illness as well as lax punishment of repeat violence and drug related offenders.
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:iconcodepurpleyedrawings:
CodePurpleyedrawings Featured By Owner Dec 25, 2012  Hobbyist Artist
These are mentally ill people. Mentally ill. America doesn't know what the hell to do with it's mentally ill, not at all. In Manhattan, there are crazy people everywhere. In fact, NYC is crawling with crazy people, you could be talking to someone, and you'll eventually realize that person could be crazy.
Anyway, the gov't just dumps it's crazy people with our veterans. On the streets! They're our homeless people! And sometimes regular ol' people! People think giving them food from the food bank and letting them alone is the trick, well it's not. And they hurt people and they rape people, (my god do they they rape people, it's common in Manhattan)
And I do hope you know, gun control laws keep honest people from getting ahold of guns.
It's not the media. It's just us.
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:iconqueencold:
QueenCold Featured By Owner Dec 25, 2012  Hobbyist Digital Artist
Japan, guys, think of Japan. Japanese kids see a lot more violent TV shows than American kids and boy do they like a good gory game! Do you ever hear about Japanese school shootings? Why not? Because from an early age these kids are taught about honor, respect and ambition. Another key factor: their parents actually feel compelled to raise them.
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:iconno-doves-fly-here:
no-doves-fly-here Featured By Owner Dec 25, 2012
A guy killed eight children at Ikeda Elementary School with a kitchen knife a few years back.
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:iconqueencold:
QueenCold Featured By Owner Dec 25, 2012  Hobbyist Digital Artist
So that was one incident. How many "incidents" has America has in the last decade?
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:iconno-doves-fly-here:
no-doves-fly-here Featured By Owner Dec 25, 2012
Irrelevant. You implied that Japanese school massacres do not occur and that was false.
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:iconqueencold:
QueenCold Featured By Owner Dec 25, 2012  Hobbyist Digital Artist
I never claimed such a thing, if you read my post carefully.
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:iconendeavor-to-freefall:
To answer that we'd have to know the real motive behind the crime. If it's something attention based then of course, but even if we gave it no attention they would ultimately do something that we can't ignore.
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:iconkillianseraphim:
KillianSeraphim Featured By Owner Dec 25, 2012  Student General Artist
I'm not saying events like this shouldn't be ignored, but perhaps they shouldn't get as much attention.
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:iconcometcolt:
CometColt Featured By Owner Dec 25, 2012  Hobbyist General Artist
Actually, I do in fact believe our media does play at least a small role in the long string of shootings we've had lately. Many would-be murderers are likely to see news coverage as inspiration for opportunities to get attention and to do the same thing as the other guy. And of course, it works every time.
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:iconno-doves-fly-here:
no-doves-fly-here Featured By Owner Dec 25, 2012
I like how people act as though school massacres are a result of anything modern, despite the fact that there have been large-scale school bombings and shootings for centuries in the United States and Europe.
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:iconpakaku:
Pakaku Featured By Owner Dec 25, 2012
It's an easy thing to blame
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:iconthegman0:
theGman0 Featured By Owner Dec 25, 2012  Hobbyist
I blame you.
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:iconpakaku:
Pakaku Featured By Owner Dec 25, 2012
I am also an easy thing to blame.

When you're out for ice-cream, and gravity knocks it out of your cone, onto the dirty ground below, just yell at the top of your lungs: "CURSE YOU PAKAKUUUUUUUUU"
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:iconthegman0:
theGman0 Featured By Owner Dec 26, 2012  Hobbyist
also when I have bad diarrhea and end up sitting on the toilet for half the day. I blame you.
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:iconlegendarysuperman:
LegendarySuperman Featured By Owner Dec 25, 2012  Hobbyist Digital Artist
I didn't watch the video, and I don't intend to, but I think it's absolutely silly to blame these things on anything but people. If someone gets a gun and shoots people, don't blame guns or the laws around guns, or whoever sold the gun. Blame the person shooting the gun. If someone gets in a car wreck because they were drunk, don't blame the car, the car manufacturer, car regulation, the alcohol, the alcohol supplier, or the alcohol regulation; blame the person.

On that note, people have been killing other people for a very long time. Before cars, guns, bombs, all that stuff, you can just use a rock or a stick. If you really need something to blame, blame people and their violent nature :shrug:
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