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November 10, 2012
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GOP: You're done, son.

:icongussiejives:
gussiejives Featured By Owner Nov 10, 2012  Hobbyist Digital Artist
Nothing more to be said, really, but it's worth explaining. Now that this election is over, we can see how devastating the loss was to the GOP.

I want to make one thing clear up front: when I say "conservative", I mean American small "c" conservatism, and I equate it to being a Republican. Are there moderates out there? Of course. Are there moderates who self-identify as conservatives? Absolutely. But they've been excommunicated from the Republican party, leaving American conservatism firmly in the hand of the Republican Part and the Republican Party only. Your David Frums and Andrew Sullivans have been cast out to wander the wilderness, or just become a "conservative" Democrat.

I consider American conservatism to be at best the David Brooks-style snake oil salesmanism or Rush Limbaugh fire-breathing moron. This is how I use the term.

Okay, that said, it's a dying brand with no return. Nationally, conservatives, the GOP, are done. You likely won't win a national election again.

Why? Two reasons:

:bulletblue: Simple aging of the base.
:bulletblue: The cruelty of the policies don't appeal to the minorities and young people.

We saw the "moderate" face of your extreme policies in Mitt Romney and Paul Ryan. And American rejected them wholesale. We normal people aren't the bigoted bastards who capriciously deal out suffering through cuts that they thought we are, or would vote on. We don't like Randian orthodoxy that hurts poor people just for the sake of a hierarchy. We don't like the guys who obsess over forcing women to give birth to their rape babies for Jesus. We don't like people who suggest making the lives of immigrants so horrible that they self-deport. Sure, you kept the House with gerrymandering, but that's all that saved your asses. Sure, you can capture State Houses, but how long with that go on for when your base dies off?

Conservatives, Objectivists, religious fundamentalists, you need to change and grow up, or you will be the outliers within the next 25 years.

So:

:bulletred: Is it possible for these groups to admit how flawed their policies are?
:bulletred: Can moderate polices actually make a comeback with, say, a third party? (Think red Tories in the Canadian tradition).
:bulletred: Will they march into the abyss, or actually make a change?

And the question I want to ask directly to conservatives in the States:

:bulletyellow: If you consider yourself a moderate conservative, why do you hitch your wagon to the GOP, the party of the crazies and fundamentalists?
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Devious Comments

:iconalgideon:
AlGideon Featured By Owner Nov 18, 2012  Hobbyist Traditional Artist
Not really, The republicans still got 47% of the vote,

More over their policies and political campaigning might return with vengeance just as it did in 2010.

For the GOP, they could change their policies to reflect the power of solid voting bloc's such as single women and single moms. Or they could just focus heavily on strengthening their base, registering voters and create new wedge issues.

Abortion? Forget about it. Perhaps focus on taxes, pit it as this sort of question "Why should X tax dollars go to fun Y groups choices?" You'll find the GOP back once more.
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:iconscnal:
Scnal Featured By Owner Nov 18, 2012  Hobbyist Digital Artist
Don't think they're done. They already got a half-popular candidate that people know the name of, whereas Obama can't run for another term and the democrats don't really have anyone left that people know and would vote for. Republicans want revenge for Obama getting in, while democrats are relatively pretty satisfied for now.

If they play their cards right, they've got one term pretty much already. Not sure what'd happen afterwards.
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:iconmiletich2:
miletich2 Featured By Owner Nov 15, 2012  Hobbyist Writer
I am politically neutral, which makes me neither conservative nor liberal. Hers's what I want to happen in America. Here's what I'm saying to President Obama. If he's fed up with the death threats and the crybaby Republicans such as Donald Trump, these are his objectives.

:bulletpurple:Stop the reckless spending and pay off the national debt. I don't care if the president doesn't care if it's not too important to deal with.
:bulletpurple:Ensure that big cities such as Los Angeles and Bakersfield have far cleaner transportation like subways. I am aware that public transportation isn't so flexible and hardly anything can be done to make it so.
:bulletpurple:Gay marriages should be legal all over the United States. Not only is it a good way to control population growth, but also to make things more flexible to gays and lesbians.
:bulletpurple:Like Mitt Romney said, it's time to turn the page. I want to see no more recessions and no 2nd Great Depression. Also I wanna see no World War III between the GOP and Democrats.
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:icondefinedeviancydown:
DefineDeviancyDown Featured By Owner Nov 15, 2012  Hobbyist General Artist
Conservatism is on the ascendancy. Watch out, it will sneak up on you as it is the dominant thought in American politics ie the majority agree with conservative ideas. Of course you'll deny this! The traditional, old guard Republican party is dying. The party of Bush, Rove, McCain, Graham, Boehner and their ilk. Conservatives have been betrayed by these people and that betrayal has led to their own demise.
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:iconjackmolotov3:
JackMolotov3 Featured By Owner Dec 2, 2012  Hobbyist Photographer
"Conservatism is on the ascendancy."

probably no. It peaked around 2011, with 2010 being the peak election cycle. At best its plateauing, if anything on a slight decline. Not to say the conservative movement is in any bit finished, but its hardly the dominant thought.

If anything a good chunk of the new conservative base is now libertarian.

" Watch out, it will sneak up on you as it is the dominant thought in American politics ie the majority agree with conservative ideas. Of course you'll deny this!"
and the liberals claim the same thing, with the same polls full of skewed loaded questions.
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:icongh-mongo:
GH-MoNGo Featured By Owner Nov 12, 2012  Professional
Meh... enjoy Fox Noise complaining about it for the next four years. The electorate can and will change at the drop of a hat.
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:iconsherberttcat:
SherbertTCat Featured By Owner Nov 14, 2012  Hobbyist Digital Artist
Heh, "Fox Noise". Rather like that.
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:icongh-mongo:
GH-MoNGo Featured By Owner Nov 15, 2012  Professional
I can't take credit for it. Keith Olbermann started using that name on his old show "Countdown".
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:iconunvalanced:
Unvalanced Featured By Owner Nov 12, 2012  Hobbyist Writer
2% less popular vote = "Rejected wholesale"

Funny, how did that whole 2004 election go?
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:iconsnuffles11:
snuffles11 Featured By Owner Nov 12, 2012  Hobbyist General Artist
Where have you been? D:
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:iconunvalanced:
Unvalanced Featured By Owner Nov 12, 2012  Hobbyist Writer
Avoiding the politics forum during election season, of course.
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:iconscnal:
Scnal Featured By Owner Nov 18, 2012  Hobbyist Digital Artist
It wasn't that bad. TBS was saying how guaranteed Romney's victory was and then when he didn't he started calling most blacks (the ones that voted for Obama) racist. That's probably the only thing out of the ordinary.
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:iconsnuffles11:
snuffles11 Featured By Owner Nov 12, 2012  Hobbyist General Artist
Ah. Well, you missed a lot. Probably better that way.
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:iconunvalanced:
Unvalanced Featured By Owner Nov 12, 2012  Hobbyist Writer
That's what I figured.

The last election was at least interesting; the Democrats were all fired up.

This election season was just sad and pathetic. There wasn't enthusiasm from either side, just a resounding bitterness.
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:iconsnuffles11:
snuffles11 Featured By Owner Nov 12, 2012  Hobbyist General Artist
Gary Johnson won a single county in Kansas. I totally fist pumped.
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:iconunvalanced:
Unvalanced Featured By Owner Nov 15, 2012  Hobbyist Writer
Lord Vetinari didn't win any counties, sadly. But the election was a sham anyways; a hundred million votes? One man, one vote. Clearly there was ballot-stuffing.
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:iconmeanus:
meanus Featured By Owner Nov 12, 2012
thats weird, I don't feel devastated?
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:icontehbigd:
tehbigd Featured By Owner Nov 12, 2012
I don't see the US switching to a one-party system, but I do see the Republicans in serious trouble without changing the way they approach the electorate.
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:iconzer05um:
Zer05um Featured By Owner Nov 17, 2012  Professional General Artist
I don't either, but I foresee a period of rather strange politics until a new right wing party forms properly, or (and I consider this to be a less probable outcome) the GOP gets its collective ass in gear.
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:iconherbaldrink:
HerbalDrink Featured By Owner Nov 12, 2012
If there's anything we need more of a third party so that they'd be forced to form coalitions with the other to get something passed instead of "we have the majority so eff you". :/
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:icontehbigd:
tehbigd Featured By Owner Nov 12, 2012
[link]
The way we've got our system set up now, it's next to impossible for a third party to acquire real power.
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:iconherbaldrink:
HerbalDrink Featured By Owner Nov 12, 2012
yeah, unfortunately and if it does, it'll just be the libertarians and they'll just block many things ust cause it's not conservative enough. :/
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:iconmeanus:
meanus Featured By Owner Nov 12, 2012
yeah, they only got over 58 million votes, they have no support
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:iconjackmolotov3:
JackMolotov3 Featured By Owner Nov 12, 2012  Hobbyist Photographer
"Okay, that said, it's a dying brand with no return. Nationally, conservatives, the GOP, are done. You likely won't win a national election again."

I think your far out on left field on this one, drawing conclusions from the presidential race only, and ignoring the senate and house of representatives.

Just a reminder the republicans retained control of the house, and the dems made a narrow gain if you want to call it that in the senate(with an independent in maine, a moderate with a distaste for partisan politics)

The GOP is still viable, but I think this proves that for the first time since LBJ, that liberalism is equally viable nationally by itself, and not something the country just swings to when they are pissed off at republicans.

"
Why? Two reasons:

:bulletblue: Simple aging of the base.
:bulletblue: The cruelty of the policies don't appeal to the minorities and young people.
"

This is what they said in the 1960s after the democrats had an almost complete stranglehold on politics, period. Barry Goldwater got the biggest asswhopping in history at the time in the 1964 president elections vs LBJ. He only won 3 states in the deep south, and only won them because of the Civil Rights Act, Johnson supported to keep the larger mess of liberals in new england. Before the Civil Rights Act, LBJ had the deep south too, and it would have been a shutout.

Conservatism was just not generally accepted in society as a whole in 1964.

It was only a short 8 years later where Goldwater Disciple, Richard Millhouse Nixon, defeated last-honest-man-in-politics Democrat George McGovern in an even bigger landslide(Mcgovern won only massachusets), and the same liberal ideas were all but discredited.

The Republicans held the national narrative for the next 36 years, as liberalism was generally discredited, and the dems had a really hard time in national politics ever since, and kept in power as centrists.
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:iconzeruch:
zeruch Featured By Owner Nov 12, 2012  Professional General Artist
Nationally, conservatives, the GOP, are done.

Totally disagree. History proves this out. Party politics in the US over the long view has shown a marked ability to transform itself. I see no reason to rule that out now.
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:iconrockstar1009:
rockstar1009 Featured By Owner Nov 11, 2012  Hobbyist Writer
As much as my progressive soul enjoys seeing the oppressors go down in flames, I really don't think anyone should be celebrating the fall of tyranny yet. For reasons, and stuff.

:bulletblue: The electorate can turn on a dime. Don't believe me? Look at LBJ - by embracing the Civil Rights Act, he acknowledged he was giving the Democratic bastion of the Deep South to the Republicans for at least a generation - he was RIGHT. A region or Demographic can change sides in an instant depending upon the circumstances.

:bulletblue: OMG LATINOS. Marco Rubio is already taking the first baby steps for the GOP nomination in 2016. Already righties are speculating that he could be their saviour and deliver Latinos to them (lol except he's Cubano and most Latinos in the US are Mexican or from another Central American nation and don't identify with Cubans, but whatevs - they all look the same, mirite?). The GOP is also actively trying to push their ideologically pure Black candidates like Alan West and Mia Love, but gaining no traction there, either (how Love failed in Utah despite a late lead in the polls, I'll never know - more than likely the Bradley Effect kicked in and her supporters told pollsters they'd vote for her but then decided they couldn't stomach the concept and voted for the white man instead, even if he was an evil pinko commie Democrat... at least he's the right shade). With the right candidate, they could easily capture power again. One thing's for sure, though - none of the clowns from the primaries was CLOSE to being the right candidate. NOT A ONE.

:bulletblue: Voters are crazy. Another interesting tidbit discovered from this election is that voters are strange. I don't mean quirky - I mean FUCKING STRANGE. The first sign was the midnight returns from Dixville Notch, New Hampshire - the results were a 5-5 tie for Obama and Romney. No surprise there; the polls showed a dead heat. The real oddity was Tea Party governor candidate Ovide Lamontagne leading his Democrat candidate 7-3. That means at least 2 Obama voters preferred a Tea Party governor. The exit polls showed this same quirk occurring: ELEVEN PERCENT OF TEA PARTIERS VOTED FOR OBAMA NATIONALLY. How any of that makes sense is beyond me. :shrug: DO NOT EXPECT VOTERS TO MAKE SENSE, EVER. In 4 years, even if the economy is in great shape and the Democrats have every reason to deserve reelection, don't be surprised if voters choose a weak Republican for no rational reason whatsoever.

:bulletblue: Finding the right candidates to sell the message. If they can agree to sacrifice one or two positions for a solid candidate (IE going with a semi-pro-choice Republican like Condi Rice), they could make solid inroads among long-abandoned demographics (in Condi's case, she could definitely pull Blacks and women and probably a large number of independents and centrist Dems). The electorate isn't completely racist/sexist, though. An exceptionally charming white man could sell the platform to minorities (dear Blacks: I know you want good jobs, like guns, and hate the police and guess what? we're the party of jobs, guns and miniscule government!; dear Latinos: I know you're Catholic and guess what? we're God's party!), but a white male that charismatic hasn't been among the Republican ranks since Abe Lincoln.

:bulletblue: White people are disappearing. Right now, the GOP is struggling with an identity crisis in the face of an evolving electorate. The Latino population is exploding. They now outnumber Blacks and have become the #2 ethnicity, knocking Blacks down to #3. In some states, they've nearly tied whites (Texas, Cali) and have already succeeded them in New Mexico to become the largest ethnicity. Once the GOP learns to embrace Latinos, they could probably survive even without Black support.

:bulletblue: Expect the unexpected. New political rising stars emerge each cycle. The GOP may even find a rising Latino star able to capitalise on their strengths and overcome their weaknesses and salvage even the seemingly defunct GOP in the next cycle. A day is a long time in politics. 4 years is an eternity and A LOT can change in that time.

The GOP is down, but far from out.
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:iconunvalanced:
Unvalanced Featured By Owner Nov 12, 2012  Hobbyist Writer
ELEVEN PERCENT OF TEA PARTIERS VOTED FOR OBAMA NATIONALLY. How any of that makes sense is beyond me

- A lot of the tea party despised Romney more than they despised Obama, and saw his nomination as a sign that the Republican party was taking their base for granted.
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:iconjackmolotov3:
JackMolotov3 Featured By Owner Nov 12, 2012  Hobbyist Photographer
":bulletblue: The electorate can turn on a dime. Don't believe me? Look at LBJ - by embracing the Civil Rights Act, he acknowledged he was giving the Democratic bastion of the Deep South to the Republicans for at least a generation - he was RIGHT. A region or Demographic can change sides in an instant depending upon the circumstances. "
LBJ bit hard on this one. But if he didn't embrace the civil rights, he would have the liberals. The Civil Rights Act cost him a total of three states in the "deep south", who were really segregation die hards, he still kept a good chunk of the south. Thats far more than he would have lost opposing civil rights.

What killed LBJ was the war in vietnam. He had no good options on that one, he knew it, and quit politics. the resulting power vaccum destroyed the democrats.

":bulletblue: OMG LATINOS. Marco Rubio is already taking the first baby steps for the GOP nomination in 2016"

Cubanos already swing republican after Reagan courted them with amnesty in the 1980s. Reagan was the first republican to go after, and win the latino vote. Its still entirely possible, if the republicans were to shift focus at seriously court latinos.

Catholics in general were a serious democrat group, and so where jews, republicans have been able to make inroads with both, due to conservative elements with both.

Then you also have to remember that Ayn Rand was "discredited" along with Austrian Economics after the great depression, but they've made a comeback.

You could have told anyone in 2000 that Ron Paul would be taken very seriously, and people would have laughed. Not only that, Paul now has an active young voter population.

I do say the democrats have re-established themselves for the first time in 40 years as a national force, but the republicans are far from finished.
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:iconshadowmaker-241:
ShadowMaker-241 Featured By Owner Nov 11, 2012  Hobbyist Writer
The GOP has been currupt since they were renamed.
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:iconmeanus:
meanus Featured By Owner Nov 12, 2012
who told you that, JOhn Corzine, Blago, Eliot Spitzer, Anthony Weiner maybe?
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:iconshadowmaker-241:
ShadowMaker-241 Featured By Owner Nov 12, 2012  Hobbyist Writer
From what I know (although I could be wrong), the GOP was under a different name.
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:iconsherberttcat:
SherbertTCat Featured By Owner Nov 11, 2012  Hobbyist Digital Artist
Putting on my psychic future seeing hat...
*rubs temples*
Ah, I see in four years...Conservatives leaving the country en masse. They will...invade Canada...Non-French Canada.
Okay getting a clearer picture now!
They will overthrow the Canadian governemnt, and rename the country "'Merka".
Hmm after that it all goes fuzzy.
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:iconmeanus:
meanus Featured By Owner Nov 12, 2012
been fuzzy for awhile now hasn't it?
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:iconabcat:
AbCat Featured By Owner Nov 11, 2012   Writer
What Lytrigian and others have probably said about the GOP as a force to be reckoned with. Here in Britland, we thought the Conservative party was dead in 2000. It remained an ugly caricature of itself for many years, and then from 2005 onwards it moved towards the centre, and is now back in control after 13 years in the wilderness.

Romney and Ryan were never moderates. They were touted as moderates, but their policies weren't. The moderate leaders will begin to emerge at the forefront as the party pretends to reinvent itself in the next few years. Already in post election interviews, supporters were talking about how to make the party appeal more to non-whites. All it really has to do is shed its image as a friend of business, and portray itself as a friend of the people. It really doesn't even need to try that hard with Fox News and other media outlets cheering everything it does.

The Dems will be in a vulnerable place in 4 years time. I'm not seeing a lot of moving and shaking from within them and Obama has looked really poor as an orator (his delivery in this election was a mere shadow of his charisma in the keynote speech in 2004), to the extent that he won't be much help on the road to his nominal successor in 2016.

It pains me to say this as well. I hate the GOP and almost every single policy it carries. They are a scourge, in the same manner that Islamic supremacism is a scourge in the Middle East, and fascism was a scourge in interwar Europe. However, if they moderate, they will at least be less threatening, and will be less intent on making the lives of millions of Americans as miserable as possible, even if this makes them more likely to get in.
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:iconlytrigian:
Lytrigian Featured By Owner Nov 10, 2012  Hobbyist Writer
I don't know how to break this to you, but the GOP is still a force to be reckoned with. They control the House of Representatives, where all money bills must originate, and cannot be ignored. It wasn't a fluke of apportionment or timing either, as the whole House stands for re-election at the same time. If they have a majority now, it's because they WON it in THIS election.

The Presidency isn't everything. Far from it.
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:icondivine--apathia:
divine--apathia Featured By Owner Nov 11, 2012  Hobbyist Photographer
Redistricting is a major force. That's how the almost dictator Joh Bjelke Petersen stayed the premier of my state for so long.
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:iconajglass:
AJGlass Featured By Owner Nov 11, 2012  Professional Artisan Crafter
It wasn't a fluke of apportionment or timing either...

It was because of redistricting. You don't have to take my word for it, look it up for yourself how many places were oddly redistricted to keep them in Republican hands. In my state alone there were lawsuits about it.
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:icontbschemer:
TBSchemer Featured By Owner Nov 11, 2012
Redistricting happens with every census. It's the Democrats' fault that people are fleeing their districts.
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:iconajglass:
AJGlass Featured By Owner Nov 11, 2012  Professional Artisan Crafter
It's the Democrats' fault that people are fleeing their districts.

More people are fleeing Republican (rural) districts than they are Democratic districts (which tend to be more urban). More people have moved to urban areas (cities) than rural ones in general, thus favoring Democrats.
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:icontbschemer:
TBSchemer Featured By Owner Nov 11, 2012
Then why did Republican states gain electoral votes at the expense of Democratic states in the 2010 census?
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:iconajglass:
AJGlass Featured By Owner Nov 11, 2012  Professional Artisan Crafter
Lots of Democrats headed to larger cities in the South, especially as the auto industry jobs dried up in the North. Hence one reason why most analysts believe that states like Texas will turn purple and why many southern States are voting more Democratic or are becoming tossups.
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:icontbschemer:
TBSchemer Featured By Owner Nov 11, 2012
So as blue-state Michigan fails, the parasites don't learn- they just spread like locusts to other states.
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:iconsnuffles11:
snuffles11 Featured By Owner Nov 11, 2012  Hobbyist General Artist
More evidence that you don't even see them as human.
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(1 Reply)
:iconajglass:
AJGlass Featured By Owner Nov 11, 2012  Professional Artisan Crafter
Workers have always migrated to where the jobs are. In fact, our country was founded in such a fashion - with entire families willing to uproot and move to find a better life and more money elsewhere in the country. You wouldn't have likely had the industrial revolution as it was if workers had stayed put.
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:icondablackx:
DaBlackX Featured By Owner Nov 10, 2012
Outliers in the next 25 years? That's being very generous. I give them a decade, tops.
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:iconvisionoftheworld:
VISIONOFTHEWORLD Featured By Owner Nov 10, 2012
Well, I don't necessarily see the need to repeat the Democrats tired old saw about the GOP appealling to white men only. The problem isn't who they appeal to. That isn't fixed in stone, it can change every few years. I personally don't care to worry about who and what draws people to become tea baggers, to join the GOP, and to elect its candidates. I'm more worried about how Democrats can appeal to the entire nation, and frankly don't want the GOP back in charge. Ever. That political organization is just a big money pit for rich guys. They represent rich guys, and corporate interests. And there is NO line connecting corporate interests to my interests- none. Nor to anyone else's. Every single promise made by the republicans centers on cuts- shutting down programs and throwing people out in the cold. That doesn't appeal to most living, breathing human beings. Nothing about their 'platform' is positive. All of it is resentment, all of it is directed at some group of people or other, all of it is about controlling other peoples' lives, destroying freedom, forcing people into destitution, and replacing the Constitution with radical protestant theology. And all of it is being demanded by hateful, angry people- who revel in the suffering they can bring if they gain control.
I don't want that, and am not interested in how they can achieve that through elections. The rest of us shouldn't be either.
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:icontbschemer:
TBSchemer Featured By Owner Nov 11, 2012
You should be interested in how we can achieve our goals through elections. If we cannot defend liberty through elections, then we'll defend it by meeting your violent force with our own violent force. The people are arming themselves, and war is not far off.
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:iconvisionoftheworld:
VISIONOFTHEWORLD Featured By Owner Nov 18, 2012
Is this a threat I need to report or are you just wiping your bleeding ass still?
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:icongussiejives:
gussiejives Featured By Owner Nov 17, 2012  Hobbyist Digital Artist
Yeah, it worked out great last time.
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:iconsnuffles11:
snuffles11 Featured By Owner Nov 11, 2012  Hobbyist General Artist
Since you consider taxes to be "violent force", we'd be well within our rights to shoot you dead.

Thankfully for you, I don't really do that sort of thing. Because I'm not a bad shot.
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