How is it that this right has become the number one default go-to for anyone in any political debate, whether relevant or not?
Just now, our resident semi-serious troll meanus used it in the chick-fill-a debate. (Erroneously, of course, since it was never about whether or not the company had the right to express its ideals, but rather about how many customers would not contribute to the financial prosperity of a company with such ideals. In fact, those boycotting the place are actually practising their human right "To peacefully protest (speak against) a government or group" [link] )
I know that most debates in here get rather ridiculous in places. Both Politics and P&R are known for it, after all.
But I'm left wondering why freedom of speech is the go-to Politics battle cry, whether relevant or not.
*Side-note to the few, the ignorant: Other countries than America also have freedom of speech. It's considered one of the basic human rights. [link]
Because it's one of the few real freedoms we have left. Gay pride is fine. African pride is fine. Female pride is fine. White pride? All of a sudden I'm a racist bastard who hates everything and is somehow contributing to global warming while doing nothing to prevent it, and I've also declared a war on minorities.
Why the fuck do you need to be proud of your connection to the largest and most powerful panethnic group in the Western world? Do the privileges not reward you enough?
White people, as a group, is the one group that hasn't been oppressed by any of the others. It is also the group that has oppressed all the others. It is nothing new, that white pride (adopted by racist fanatics everywhere) doesn't have positive connotation. "All of a sudden" oh please...
The other 'prides' are a result of those groups wanting to do something opposite to feeling shame over what they are, which historically has been what they were made to feel.
And where in the fuck have you heard the expression 'female pride' anyway?
It's basically because the conservatives in the US are realizing how bigoted and out of touch their ideals and anti-intellectual stances are becoming in the public eye, so latching onto the liberal ideas of tolerance/free speech/political correctness is their last gasp to stay relevant. They figure that by claiming they need to continue being given a soapbox for their ideas that way, they can continue being exempt from criticism and can cry hypocrisy if anyone complains.
how come liberals come out against freedom of speech when it suits them as well. Well I admit the conservatives have done their share, trying to pin this soley on them is insane.
A good number of mainstream "liberals" came out for censorship of Rush Limbaugh for making his very predictable trolls on his radio show.
Hillary Clinton tried introducing a law that would restrict criticism of a "civil rights leader", the type who drive her voting bloc.
And freedom of speech obviously ends when the words "tea party" is brought up.
the USA is probably the only place on earth where liberals leftists come out against personal freedoms. You tell German social democrats the issues American liberals bring up and they look at you funny.
Because there's a difference between being allowed to speak freely, and having your opinion given equal respect/time/spotlight/etc. even when it's hateful, bigoted, factually wrong, etc.
Conservatives love pulling BS like saying that their diatribes against gay marriage and abortion should be respected, that they should be allowed to force prayer in public schools, their manufactured debates regards climate change and evolutions, etc. And if you dare criticize them or point out how bigoted they're being, they'll whine and cry about being oppressed, about how you're being intolerant, about how you're obligated to give them respect, etc.
Kind of like your entire post here, for instance. Allowing someone to speak doesn't mean being obligated to give them a shiny soapbox in the spotlight. It's perfectly kosher to not ban someone from speaking, but also to simply flat-out ignore them if they're patently wrong, hateful, bigoted, etc. Or to tell them they can speak, they just can't do so on a privately-owned media network.
I mean, I lol at Rush Limbaugh being censored because he can't say whatever he wants whenever he wants. When do I get to go to a secretarial job and get to tell a customer who's acting like a spoiler twat that they're being one, without getting fired? Oh noes, censorship! Because I'm not allowed to say whatever I want in whatever venue I want. But I am still allowed to say anything I want in a venue that actually allows it, or is publically free, so my free speech is not being violated.
"Conservatives love pulling BS like saying that their diatribes against gay marriage and abortion should be respected, that they should be allowed to force prayer in public schools, their manufactured debates regards climate change and evolutions, etc. And if you dare criticize them or point out how bigoted they're being, they'll whine and cry about being oppressed, about how you're being intolerant, about how you're obligated to give them respect, etc"
'respected' in the light you shouldn't be carting them off to jail, penalizing them or harassing them for the opinions, but you don't have really like them or respect them as people. I could also point out there are far worse things said and done on the internet, that aren't politically affiliated.
same when said conservatives where were about to cart all of us rock'n'roll types off to camps in the 1990s.(with the approval, or at least silence of MANY well known liberals), its the same thing I said to them. You don't have to like it, you just have to tolerate someone else saying it, or that it wasn't your business to judge anyone else's life. They also put their "sensibilities" over our freedoms. Strawmen ensued.
It gets back to the "who decides whats offensive", because if you went back 20 years, or even longer, many of your "liberal" positions might have gotten the same treatment.
"Kind of like your entire post here, for instance." I should be banned, arrested, investigated or otherwise harassed for something I've posted so far on deviant art? Something I've done is so offensive I deserve reprimand? Am I being put on a watchlist? are you going to try to solicit private eyes to investigate me? should I be worried?
Rush Limbaugh was never censored. Fortunately cooler heads prevailed. The irony was that modern democrats say freedom of speech is only when they do it. its a thin veil that means "we're going to protect our friends and go after our enemies".
kinda why I never liked "liberal" democrats. They had some great ideas, except when it came time to implement them they always did so in the exact same fashion as their conservative counterparts, and got the same results. Then they bitch, complain, and scratch their heads why there is even room for so called conservative. It gets worse when they try and cover for the politicians they just hyped up to not look like so special ed when it comes out they're full of shit.
For what its worth the independents seem to be far more levelheaded, because it seems they
Just now, our resident semi-serious troll meanus used it in the chick-fill-a debate.
(Erroneously, of course, since it was never about whether or not the company had the right to express its ideals, but rather about how many customers would not contribute to the financial prosperity of a company with such ideals. In fact, those boycotting the place are actually practising their human right "To peacefully protest (speak against) a government or group" [link] )
I know that most debates in here get rather ridiculous in places.
Both Politics and P&R are known for it, after all.
But I'm left wondering why freedom of speech is the go-to Politics battle cry, whether relevant or not.
*Side-note to the few, the ignorant: Other countries than America also have freedom of speech. It's considered one of the basic human rights. [link]