Elohim N Stuff


sayhanabdullah's avatar
What is the origin of the Divine Plural interpretation of The Scriptures? Who was the first to read, for example, The Torah in Hebrew, and conclude that "Elohim" in The Torah is a nonliteral plural, a divine plural?

There must have been Torah scholars who said, "Well, 'Elohim' can't mean 'gods' because we only believe in one GOD, so it must be using a nonliteral plurality to imply GOD'S magnitude and majesty."

I wonder what Moses himself would tell us if we could ask him.
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avih1's avatar
Luckily, those of us who speak Hebrew can tell that Elohim is not necessarily a plural form, as can be proven by how in most cases the bible treats the word Elohim as a singular form.
sayhanabdullah's avatar
I'm looking for sources. I want to know who were the first people in history to have suggested the Divine Plural idea, and to have written about it. For example, did the ancient Rabbis ever write about it?
avih1's avatar
You'll have to be more specific as to the 'Divine Plural Idea'.
For the few places where the word Elohim is treated as a plural form, there are various explanations as to why. The most well known example is from the story of creation: "We shall make man in our image..." (I freely translated this from memory, to lazy to go look for any official translation...). The most well known answer in this case is that god was consulting his angles. There are many more explanations which I don not remember offhand. I can look it up if you like.
sayhanabdullah's avatar
Like I said, I'm looking for sources. I'm sure that at some point, before the Divine Plural idea existed, somebody was reading The Torah, and wondered about the use of the plural form "Elohim," and then explained it as a "divine plural." I want to know who. 
avih1's avatar
Again, I'm not sure what idea you are referring to, but it's likely do have been developed by Christians using translation. Christianity seems to dislike non-literal interpretations of the bible, which makes it all the more difficult to convey the bible's meaning in a translation.
sayhanabdullah's avatar
I mean the idea that GOD refers to Himself using a plural, in order for the plural to signify HIS majesty.

It occurs in The Qur'an too.
avih1's avatar
It probably appears somewhere in one of the answers for the question i brought earlier (and others), but it's not necessarily very prominent or accepted. Judaism will always just bring a multitude of answers for any question and generally say that they are all correct...
doctirderp's avatar
well back in the day there were more then one gods, and they were called the EL, and the all high was called ELOHIM, whom was yahweh. yahweh is still the all high god of the old testement, when they refer to god; and he ruled over the pantheon before jews had a monothiestic religion.
skulkey's avatar
actually, you have it somewhat backward.  Elohim (plural) were the children of El (singular), in the Canaanite pantheon.
KillianSeraphim's avatar
People had revelation of the Trinity in the Old Testament.  Rather than God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit; they would have been called God, the Word of God (John 1:1 explains), and the Spirit of God.
Elgrig's avatar
Elohim is a nice name though.
skulkey's avatar
Elohim, as far as we understand, came [in part, the Ugaritic "ihm"] from the Canaanites (they had a pantheon of gods).  the ancient Israelites also had a pantheon, the entirety of which were the Elohim.  when they took on monotheism, YHWH became the deity of choice, and was granted the title Yahweh Elohim, which then took on its singular meaning.
Abstract-Mindser's avatar
Well, when the Abrahamic god queued with his shopping trolley at the elevator...
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skulkey's avatar
Elohim and elevate come from two entirely different languages.
LazyBoneArtist's avatar
You have some weird etymological understanding... But yeah, it makes sense
Lytrigian's avatar
Novuso has a habit of relating entirely unrelated languages to each other, such as Biblical Hebrew and modern English, and pretty much never makes sense.
LazyBoneArtist's avatar
Yeah, but I have to admit that, "I am but I am" was pretty funny
Lytrigian's avatar
He managed to misquote the entire passage.
LazyBoneArtist's avatar
I wouldn't have a clue what the entire passage is, I found the Popeye the sailor manesque quote funny, "I am what I am"
Lytrigian's avatar
Rather, Popeye was near-quoting God there. Exodus 3:14
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SleinadFlar's avatar
Apparantly Elohim (in the meaning of God), although formally plural, is grammatically singular, as it is in concord with singular adjectives (except Elohim Hayiym "Living God") and singular verbs. It's also used in some cases for plural 'gods', with plural adjectives and plural verbs.

It's certainly not refering to the Trinity, or to multiple aspects of God, and it's also not a pluralis majestatis, as Hebrew lacks such a construction. It's one of those quirks in language, just like English 'series' or 'sheep' can be both singular and plural. My (rather uneducated) guess is that Elohim at first did refer to a pantheon, back when the Hebrews were still polytheistic, just like their neighbours (the singular El is attested as the name of a god in the Ugarite pantheon). By the time the bible was written down, the word and the meaning had already become singular.

(edit: ninja-ed by Lytrigian)
sayhanabdullah's avatar
Then why do they translate it as:

And GOD (ELOHIM) said, "Let US make man in OUR image."

?
SleinadFlar's avatar
This website (www.hebrew-streams.org/works/m… mentions 6 options:

1) God is speaking to members of his heavenly council.

2) God is speaking to himself, in self-deliberation ("Let us do this" = "I've decided I will do this").

3) God is using the "royal we," as ancient monarchs did when issuing divine decrees. This occurs in the Qur'an when Allah speaks as "we": "To Jesus, son of Mary, We gave clear evidence of the truth" [2:87].

4) The plural pronouns match the plural noun Elohim (God) in what some call a "plural of majesty." Earthly monarchs do this all the time.

5) The plurals are a vestige of polytheistic belief that the Israelites borrowed from their pagan neighbors. God is speaking to a pantheon of fellow deities.

6) God the Father is speaking to other members of the Trinity: either to God the Spirit or to God the (preincarnate) Son, or both.

Take your pick. I'm going for option 5, which also ties in with option 1.