Deviant Login Shop  Join deviantART for FREE Take the Tour

Details

Closed to new replies
January 26, 2013
Link

Statistics

Replies: 182

How about having an intelligent friendly conversation?

:iconnoleah:
noleah Jan 26, 2013   Digital Artist
Looking through the forums, I'm not really sure thats possible here. All I see are a lot of people trolling over each other and trying to prove one another wrong when it is obvious neither side will be swayed.

I would actually like to be able to talk to someone on the topic of religion who can actually sit there and talk to me in an intelligent manner. Yes I'm new to the DA forums, but I'd like to believe there are still a couple people out there who are able to do this.

Yes, I am atheist. I used to call myself a Christian until I realized it was stupid and pointless to try and convince myself of something I could simply not make myself believe. I'm not asking you to convince me, nor will I attempt to convince you, I would just like to be able to talk about the different points of religion, and why we each believe what we believe.

I sure this will shortly evolve into people bashing each other, or trying to make arguments that neither side will accept. I'm not looking to have a religious argument. I just want to discuss religion with someone who will not turn around and bash me for being atheist or try to convince me that I'm wrong.

This is something that I think about on a daily basis. I question things in life a lot of us take for granted, and I question a lot of things that are controversial, and religion is one of the bigger things I think about. I've pondered on it for years, done my research for both sides, contributed in several heavily Christian and Catholic oriented projects, read the bible, argued it out with people, and in the end, I still believe what I believe. I'm not interested in you trying to convince me nor am I interested in convincing you, no matter if I think your own logic is flawed or not or if you think mine is. We are entitled to our own opinions. One of the people I know at work, whom could be considered my boss in a loose term, is very Christan, doesn't believe in evolution saying that its just as illogical as religion is. And while I disagree, and even as he tries to convince me to visit his church, I still refuse to argue the point. I think neither less or more of him because I know this, and if I did it would just make my job miserable. I've argued it out before, I've seen different arguments, and each one makes me think harder on the whole subject. I am completely open to know what you think and why. I for one know that there is another person behind the screen, and I respect your opinion.

I'm ok with debating different points, I like to know why you believe in what you do. I'm just tired of seeing all the bashing. So go ahead, bash me if it makes you feel better, but if I can get at least one intelligent non-bashing conversation out of this I would be happy. I'm perfectly happy talking to anyone, atheist, Christian, Catholic, and all other religions no matter how small or obscure. It is not my intention to insult or bash anyone for thier religion, I simply enjoy learning and educating myself.

Thats it for my wall of text. I'd simply like to know, what and why do you believe what you believe? What shaped your choice in this? And anything else you feel should be added.
Reply

You can no longer comment on this thread as it was closed due to no activity for a month.

Devious Comments

:iconsilenttrain:
SilentTrain Jan 29, 2013  Hobbyist Digital Artist
"...Christian until I realized it was stupid and pointless..." Is personally what I believe your issue is. This statement could easily be considered rude and thoughtless. Though, you most likely didn't intend for it to be that way.

Now, if you want to talk about religion as a whole, you should promise to be more respectful not by saying it, but by proving it with your actions.

- I am a Christian, however unlike many believers of my Religious views and similar to early-age Illuminati, I believe that science and religion are simply different versions of the same story. What true Christian ever said that God couldn't have started the big bang? Or, what Atheist ever said that evolution couldn't have been simplified into the biblical story of Adam and Eve? Is it logically possible for both sides for both sides to believe, yes I think so.

Do both sides believe this? Probably not. These are my views on these complex and highly diverse topics.
Reply
:iconnoleah:
noleah Jan 29, 2013   Digital Artist
Yes, oftentimes if you chop of the beginning and end of a sentence or chop out the middle, you can make it mean something completely different. I could do the same thing with one of your sentences. And if people really feel like they have to get pissed off at me about something and they want to dig for something, sure, they can bring that up. But they can't even use that as proof because all I have to do is quote the whole sentence and it completely negates their claim.

I have proved it, every conversation I've had here has stayed civil and not erupted into an argument no matter how the person treated me or my beliefs and what their own beliefs are. Even with the last person to point out that same sentence. I've gotten to have some very in depth conversations about religion and other people's beliefs already.

I'm offering to be open-minded with people here. If they really want to bring up the middle of a sentence, while ignoring the fact that I just called my own actions stupid and pointless, then I can ignore their attempts to anger me.
Reply
:iconsilenttrain:
SilentTrain Jan 29, 2013  Hobbyist Digital Artist
No offense, but I was not looking for an argument and I didn't have to share my views with you.

If you're not able to carry on a civilized conversation with me because I offered you some constructive criticism, you shouldn't be offering to carry out civilized conversations about religion.

I apologize if I've offended you, however I don't see you apologizing for offending me.

Best of luck with your civilized conversations. Once again, I am sorry for not being able to have that civilized conversation with you. I really hope you can have a civilized conversation with somebody else about similar views that I have to share.

Et tu Brute.
Reply
:iconnoleah:
noleah Jan 29, 2013   Digital Artist
My intention was not to be rude, though I realize over the internet it is extremely easy to see it that way. But yes, it picks a nerve to have that pointed out once more when I cannot do anything to change it and that it reminds me so much of when people will just twist a sentence to their own means. So now I have to look at all my sentences and make sure you can't re-arrange the words just to make me sound rude. Yes it bothers me that I cannot say something without people finding fault with it. >.< I did not intend to offend you.
Reply
:iconsilenttrain:
SilentTrain Jan 29, 2013  Hobbyist Digital Artist
I didn't rearrange your words. They are your words exactly and as I said, you most likely didn't intend for it to sound that way.
Reply
:iconalzebetha:
Hello! I'm your man. I can talk intelligently, I just like to state my mind, and pay back stupid remarks with stupid remarks.

I don't agree with your position, as I believe one has only one life to stand up for whatever they know, they think to be true(I avoid believe here explicitely, faith is a lack of knowledge) with those little monkeybrains of theirs, and no, as the introduction may mislead I am not an Atheist, I picked the LaVeyan Satanism for myself.. well in a way the introduction hinted at that, though it is more obscure.

I found myself identifying with this viewpoint more then anything else, to say it simply, it is basically rational secular christianism, while accepting that a religious framework gives pleasurable thoughts and feelings, it's also a very narcissitic attitude, wich suits me just well, as I am the greatest human being on the earth, at least from my own perspective. I remember a moment where a very good evangelical religious teacher of mine asked 'who is closest to you' and while many people said god, jesus, parents, true love, he always shook his head and finally said.. 'No, it's yourself' Interestingly the only class I ever got an A+ in was his too so perhaps we thought similiar about everything, but anyway. I'd not say that this was the moment where I went AHA! and jumped to my new faith but it describes itself, and similiar alike thought processes that lead me to my current 'believe'

I think this is more then enough elaboration on what shaped my choice. anything else, well, I obviously believe my believe to be superior to others, but I am also aware that if you ask a pro wrestler if fighting with people is fun you may get a slightly biased answer equally.
Reply
:iconnoleah:
noleah Jan 29, 2013   Digital Artist
Well I'd certainly stand up for my belief if I were in a debate, but right now I'm just offering to be open-minded. :3 And perhaps a bit to show people that its not what you believe that shapes you. Just because one atheist is an asshole doesn't mean all of them are. See? I'm not an asshole. The same goes for other religions and beliefs.

XD I find that teacher very interesting, and at the same time I like how he looks at that. I almost envy people who can jump into their own religion or belief as something that seemed to have been made for them. X3 Most people have to struggle to discover what it is they believe. Sometimes I think religion complicates life more than it needs to, and at the same time religion, and non-religion are, in the most basic sense, just different ways of understanding the world around you. We all choose to understand life the best we can. I think everyone thinks their belief is superior to others XD Otherwise why would we believe it?
Reply
:iconalzebetha:
I don't believe other religions/believes to be assholes,I just believe them to be stupid and deluded, and myself to be an asshole.

one could say I struggled a bit to discover things, but when I did it was a bit of an aha! moment.. if I'd be a less intelligent person(see how I harp on that), I'd call it a moment of enlightenment.. identifying with a certain doctrine to a vast extend that is.

I don't think everyone is able or willing to introspect on the validity of their believe, for many it is just defining part of their nature, and questioning it, immoral(think of red state america). Of course those are the most invalid believers in my opinion.
Reply
:iconmuffin-machine:
Muffin-Machine Jan 28, 2013  Hobbyist General Artist
as long as the statement "I Am" is followed by further description there will be debate and conversations will be useless.
Reply
:iconnoleah:
noleah Jan 29, 2013   Digital Artist
So, 'I am atheist.' will spark a debate as well as 'I am completely open to know what you think and why.'
And while yes, people have already pointed out both of these and said something about it, none of those turned into debates. *shrugs* people have already insulted my belief here multiple times, and yet, no debate, no insulting back, no arguing. People have challenged my openness to other people's opinions, but I didn't challenge back, and thus no debates and no arguments. Yes at some point two other people here will no doubt start arguing or debating over something and there is little I can do about it, but I won't be starting any debates. My sole purpose here is to find the few people who want to be able to talk about their religion without being insulted, and I've actually already found a couple, so I consider this worthwhile.
Reply
Add a Comment: