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November 15, 2012
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Is my client too demanding? I made over 100 logos!!

:iconantu:
Antu Featured By Owner Nov 15, 2012  Hobbyist General Artist
I'm working an internship where I'm designing for several different start up companies getting paid $300 a month. Lousy pay, but I need the experience. One start up has been taking up most of my time and I've designed literally about 100 logos for them, maybe more. Granted, they've changed their name twice, but still. And when I get their feedback, they request drastic changes, completely different directions. Well I've just got the most frustrating request today. They want me to forget aaaallll those other designs and use the crappy one they had before I even started designing for them, which is overused, not original at all.

What should I do? Should I say something? Should I keep quiet and just do what they ask? When is enough enough? What is the proper designer to client etiquette in these situations? I'm doing all of this work as an internship, it's not like they're paying me for all of this hard work. And I'm supposed to be focusing on other companies as well.
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Devious Comments

:icontetchist:
Tetchist Featured By Owner Nov 18, 2012  Professional Digital Artist
"I'm working an internship..."

well, that's your problem right there.
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:icondanielgee:
DanielGee Featured By Owner Nov 19, 2012  Hobbyist Digital Artist
+1 :D
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:icontetchist:
Tetchist Featured By Owner Nov 19, 2012  Professional Digital Artist
:thumbsup:
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:iconyeleena:
Yeleena Featured By Owner Nov 16, 2012  Student Digital Artist
Say you turn this down and then you get kicked off the internship thing. Your next employer asks why you didn't finish your internship. "I can't fulfil what's been asked of me."

That being said you should talk to your client instead of being treated like a doormat! Talk like compromise, like a meeting. Do bot talk back. Be polite and have manners (:
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:iconprisma61:
prisma61 Featured By Owner Nov 16, 2012  Hobbyist Digital Artist
Are you the person responsible for managing the direct relationship with the client? If so, your employer has not given you the necessary tools. As mentioned below, there should be timeline/budget considerations. Managing time/budget is critical to a projects success, for both sides of the relationship.

If the person managing this client/project is not you, they are the person to discuss this issue with, and see if you are still within the scope of the project. If you are being asked to manage this relationship with little or no guidance, there are a couple of issues. First, you shouldn't be considered an intern, and should receive proper wages. And second, you have not been given the scope information necessary to do your job.

I know this seems like a painful process, but get used to it. Learning how to manage these situations effectively is a crucial element to business relations.

Best of luck!
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:iconevanatt:
Evanatt Featured By Owner Nov 16, 2012
I am in a internship too atm.
And I can tell there have been changes here and then here too, and sometime it have been frustrating, but sometime needed I guess.

But 100 logos is a bit overkill I guess.
I think you should talk about it indeed. Do not be afraid to discuss this, and also give your own thought what is good and bad, and why it is.
Sometime people don't really know what they want, so sometime you have to lead them toward a design by sharing your thought about what is good and what is not.
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:iconfriendlyhand:
FriendlyHand Featured By Owner Nov 15, 2012  Professional Digital Artist
A really good client knows what they want, explains it clearly, provides useful feedback, and is pleased when the project goals have been met.

A bad client may not know what they want, may not be able to explain it clearly, may simply want to "be in control" of the project but lack the knowledge or experience to be effective in that role, may keep changing their mind, may wander aimlessly hoping for that design that they'll "know when they see it", may make choices based on their good or bad mood instead of rational criteria. I've worked for a crazy client so I understand your pain.

It's always possible that they just didn't dig your style. That doesn't mean your choices were bad or their taste was bad. Sometimes project partners just aren't a good fit.

Although it's frustrating, it doesn't sound like it is affecting your pay. You could ask for your supervisors opinion. If the company feels that you could be better utilized on another project, they will make that decision.
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:iconspudfuzz:
Spudfuzz Featured By Owner Nov 15, 2012  Hobbyist Digital Artist
Man... shouldn't you be charging extra if they keep changing their minds that much? I'm no designer but still.....
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:icondamaimikaz:
DamaiMikaz Featured By Owner Nov 15, 2012  Hobbyist Digital Artist
The method on handling this differs per company.
I'd advice you to ask one of your senior designers for advice on what to do.
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:iconslash000:
slash000 Featured By Owner Nov 15, 2012   Artist
Take it to your boss or senior designer first. Tell them the situation, ask them for advice or what they would do. If it sounds ridiculous to them, they'll know how to handle it.

It sounds to me like the client you're dealing with is one of these that thinks they want something fresh and new but deep down psychologically they just want the same old thing. The result is that they want something "new" but refuse anything that actually IS new.

I've seen people with that issue in all areas of business, it can be ridiculous.
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:iconantu:
Antu Featured By Owner Nov 15, 2012  Hobbyist General Artist
That's an interesting psychological take on it. I wonder if that's the case.
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:iconnokari:
nokari Featured By Owner Nov 15, 2012  Professional Interface Designer
If you're an intern, have you talked to any senior designers from the company you're working for? Does the contract not have any rules about the number of logos or rounds of revisions the client can have?
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:iconantu:
Antu Featured By Owner Nov 15, 2012  Hobbyist General Artist
The contract is with a company that helps start ups, not with the start ups themselves. I'm talking to the one manager of the company to see what she thinks. I feel it's ridiculous at this point, but maybe she sees this sort of thing in start ups all the time. I don't know what's normal, but I counted 130 logos and that to me doesn't seem normal.
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:iconnokari:
nokari Featured By Owner Nov 15, 2012  Professional Interface Designer
130 for one startup?
It's not exactly unheard of really. My first year of school we had to sketch out 100 thumbnail logos each for one project and then spent weeks narrowing down our choices and refining them. I also talked to another art director that said they had a client that they made so many thumbnail logos for that they put them all up and they stretched an entire hallway and then some. Easily 200+ logos. But that was a whole group of designers making as many as they could..

Anyways, the point I was getting to was that normally there's a contract drawn up that puts limits on this stuff so that the agency isn't throwing money down the drain for a client who can't make up his mind and forces the client to pay fees if they go over the limits. It's always good to set a schedule and limits. Then they have to make a choice of going with what you've got or spending more money. But you should also work hard to explain your reasons for your design choices and try to convince them to pick a few that you think best represent their business.
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:iconelectrifried:
electrifried Featured By Owner Nov 15, 2012  Professional Interface Designer
Wow over 100 logos and they couldn't find something they liked? O_O that is crazy...you should really tell them what you think if they are going to go back to their original logo. At least ask for some proper feedback on your mock ups! Do they/you even know what image they want to portray? Sometimes it's just not worth it dealing with clients who don't have a clue.
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:iconantu:
Antu Featured By Owner Nov 15, 2012  Hobbyist General Artist
Yeah I think that's the problem. They're not sure what they want. And each design I show them based off of what they told me they wanted, they change their minds about. So I guess I just have to put my foot down and tell them, look... 130 is plenty to choose from. I'm just worried it's not my place, being an intern.
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:iconelectrifried:
electrifried Featured By Owner Nov 16, 2012  Professional Interface Designer
Yeah well if I was the client I'd feel bad for wasting someone's time so much o_O If I were you I'd tell them what I think honestly :XD:
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